Baileur refusing to carry out check out inventory

Concerned · #1 10-05-2010 17:48:14

Apologies for writing in English, if anyone can help, it would be appreciated.

I have a standard 9yr lease, which I terminated by registered mail in September, and moved out 3 months later.

Since then, I have tried weekly to get the landlord (or to be more exact the landlord's agent) to conduct the check out inventory. But they keep giving excuses. I am now paranoid that someone will claim I have not terminated the lease properly and will ask for rent from November until May.

The lease stated the baileur is Mrs X, represented by Agent Y (who signed)

I sent the registered letter only to Mrs X, and not to Agent Y.

However, I did physically deposit the keys back with Agent Y on December 1st, and obtained a signed paper to state receipt.

It is now May, and as I say, the agent claims they did the checkout inventory in March, but still no sign, despite calling.

I have a lengthy email chain (although not sure how much that counts for)

Time for lawyer, or I am being paranoid?

grmff · #2 10-05-2010 18:32:03

The check out inventory must be done with presence of both sides: your side and the landlord.

If you gave the keys in december, I guess you received a document proving that you gave the keys. If not you're in trouble.

This document is very important, and the wording is important too. If they accepted the keys and put no reserve on the receipt of the keys, it's good for you.

You also have to know who did the check out inventory. The agent? Or an expert? Is the expert mentionned in the contract? There are many situations, and it's too difficult to examine all those situations on a forum.

Just for your information, the e-mails do have a value in front of a judge. I even used a sms (texto) in front a judge, and it was accepted for what it is: a proof of good faith.

The question is: did you get your warranty back? Is it on a special account, or on the account of the agent?

Concerned · #3 10-05-2010 19:03:04

Grmff,

Thanks for the reply...

I was not present at the check out... it was done in March, and they gave me 1 days notice (not easy when abroad). They went ahead with it anyway and three weeks later sent me a form to sign stating that 'i give authorization' for the survey.

Since that day, I have been trying to get a copy of the survey. The expert that did the inventory is as stated on the contract. I will call him direct tomorrow.

As regards the keys, I do indeed have a document proving receipt from the agent (albeit the receptionist), although she did state she was authorized to sign. There appears to be no conditions attached.

At this stage, I am happy to pay for a lawyer to wrap this mess up. If you are qualified, please send me your details and we can take cotact.

Thanks again.

grmff · #4 10-05-2010 21:24:22

Hello Concerned,

I am not a lawyer... so, not qualified. All info I post is frommy experience, from what I read, from what I seek...

I hope for you that you did not sign the "autorization". I would be you, I would contact a lawyer to do the following:
1. Ask for liberation of the warranty, 100% for you
2. Deny the possibility to make a check out inventory 4 months after the end of the renting period, after a strong winter, and when you have been asking for it for months.It's too late.

I would not call (and certainly not write) the expert, since it could be interpreted by a judge that you agree for a check out survey monts after you left.

Keep the message asking you to sign the autorization for inventory. I guess this kind of autorisation is a letter where you give the mission to do the check out inventory to the expert... and then he has all the rights, he represents you at check out, and then it's as if you were there.

If you don't trust him, don't give him this power! And as he is probably the friend of the agent, there is no reason to trust him!

I'll be happy to inform you further, but I'm worried we could misunderstand each other. The vocabulary in courts and laws is sometimes specific and overprecise. And beyond my comprehension... Laws in differents countries can be tricky.

So, the best and cheapest on the long run is to call you lawyer...
Your case seems clear and easy...

Panchito-9340 · #5 11-05-2010 12:18:52

In order to get the big picture of your case, could you tell us:
- if your security deposit is still blocked?
- What is the exact wording of the receipt you got when you gave the keys
- In your contract, what is not written black on white that the inventory check out needed to be performed at latest the last day of your termination period?
- did you sign the authorization form they sent you for the survey?
For the lawyers and the Court, only written document can be used (registered letters = preference number 1 and then letters, eventually emails and/or sms) ...in one of the official languages of your region (only French and Dutch in Brussels-Capital)

Concerned · #6 13-05-2010 11:49:28

there is actually update on this one:

First to answer the questions:
a) guarantee is still blocked
b) receipt for keys, states 'Receipt for <address>, on behalf of <agent company> ... 2 keys, 1 post box key and one garage remote control'. All confirmed, dated and signed.

The update to the story is that I sooke with the expert, who has confirmed that the check-out took place in my absence in March (contract finished end of November) and that they found 800 euros worth of damage ... guess what, after the agent showing visitors around for 4 months in the gap period, the apartment became dirty again.

Question now, is this worth contesting, or is it just better to pay the 800 euros and write it down as another life lesson.

Once again, thanks for your input, appreciated that people actually help out like this. If any one knows a reputable lawyer who could take this on, by all means please pass on details.

Thanks!

Concerned · #7 13-05-2010 11:52:24

... and sorry forgot to mention that I did actually sign at the end of April for the inventory to be done ... I deleted all lines on the contract and wrote 'no further conditions apply' ... thsi was the only way I could get the expert to actually release the report.

grmff · #8 13-05-2010 15:41:23

For the warranty, I would contact my bank, and ask for release the warranty. Most of the banks have a note saying that the warranty is released 60 days after the end of the renting period if the owner did not claim for it....

For the paper you signed for the expert, it is impossible to give an advice if I don't read the paper.

But, indeed, if the check out only mention that the place is dirty, it is stupid from them to ask for the "damages"

Personnaly, I would send a registered letter demanding (I am not sure this word is strong enough - french: mise en demeure) the release of the warranty immédiately, contesting the inventory as done way to long after you gave the keys, and insisting that there were no condition, remark, or reserve at the time of key delivery.

This last point is very important. Because a judge might consider that the agent did not request an inventory, and that was it!

And after one month, as they will not move, I would put the case in "justice de paix", alone and without lawyer. The case is simple enough. For a french speaking guy...

Good luck.

Erico · #9 13-05-2010 22:42:46

je parle anglais assez bien, mais pas aussi bien que vous donc j'écris en français
juste une petite réflexion, si j'ai bien lu et SURTOUT bien compris le proprio demande des dommages parce qu'on a rendu le lieu sale
ben si les lieux étaient propres à l'entrée c'est logique non ?

grmff · #10 14-05-2010 06:53:48

je parle anglais assez bien, mais pas aussi bien que vous donc j'écris en français
juste une petite réflexion, si j'ai bien lu et SURTOUT bien compris le proprio demande des dommages parce qu'on a rendu le lieu sale
ben si les lieux étaient propres à l'entrée c'est logique non ?

If the owner want damages because of dirt, he should not start visits of the house and wait 4 months and a full winter for the inventory.

So, if the damage is requested because the hase was dirty, it's not the problem of Concerned

Erico · #11 14-05-2010 06:58:30

il y a sale et sale, entre des traces de pas de visiteurs et une cuisine ( graisse et autres ) et une salle de bains dégeu il y a une différence par exemple

Panchito-9340 · #12 14-05-2010 07:18:49

they found 800 euros worth of damage

I suppose they claim also for something else than only dirt?

Baileur refusing to carry out check out inventory

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